Many similar stories to Mikes tropicana example.
I went for an interview for Engineering manager position with a very large
Cross canada
Construction company. They wanted somebody who could hire and manage 20-30
(local) staff (a few junior engineers) and some (largely quite junior)
technical people ... "theyre much cheaper" when I asked about how many grey
heads/seniors,
also do the estimates and win lots of work, and run the construction
division, by the way you can use autocad too can't you, youd have to be able
to occasionally help get drawings out.
Engineering was a mess and they needed a special individual to put them in
the forefront of engineering eminence.
Sounds like four jobs to me. Whoever took that job is in a formula for failure . (I heard some rumors). No doubt the induhvidual is gonna get blamed for crappy perfomance...those damn engeering people just cant get it right..Trouble is this sort of ignorance doesnt come to roost on the perpetrators. When they start losing work , and they already have.. innocent people will get laid off in droves.
Acquiesence to these or the "tropicana" case is not the answer.
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve McKenzie [mailto:mechproj@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Sunday, April 25, 2004 6:05 AM
To: PipingDesign@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [PipingDesign] Why is it necessary for people to become
managers?
Gents
just before I slit my throat through the sheer futility of it all, I have two or so questions:
I have had a pleasant evening planning a relocation 5km of pipeline on
paper - which we will do in 24 hrs in 3 weeks time. Today I took the kids (5
&7) for a bike ride through a ford (small stream crossing - not a car) - big
excitement, and I have finally found a pair of radius arms for my 1929
Austin 7. And I just found my 30m tape which I had misplaced and blamed the
kids.
Life is not that bad, but it will look so if you dwell on the big
injustices. We all know managers and CEOs are idiots unless we happen to be
one - or know one.
Perhaps we should change from PipingDesign to WagnerianPipingDesign.
In passing, has anyone used PVC for fluosilicic acid duty (superphosphate plant) instead of CPVC and how did it work out?
Cheers
Steve (aka Bobby McFerrin)
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Bowers [mailto:pbowers@pipingdesign.com]
Sent: Sunday, April 25, 2004 2:40 PM
To: PipingDesign@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [PipingDesign] Why is it necessary for people to become
managers?
You need to read this article, written by a friend of mine:
http://www.montrealmirror.com/meat/news1.html
A different kind of "trickle down" and we need more guys like this as leaders.
Paul
From: "Al"
> Subject: Why is it necessary for people to become managers?
> To: PipingDesign@yahoogroups.com
>
>
> Its all to do with how far down the food chain and control over
> circumstances. Why do you think unions started.
>
> "Confident, skilled and experienced people need to stay where they
are".
> They are always forced to shop around , trying to beg the best deal
they can
> because they are considered replaceable and their skills rarely
understood
> and valued.
>
> I've heard many times.. "any
draftsperson/engineer/designer/planner/xxx"
> will do. Skilled journeyman/tradepeople are more valued because they
are
> more scarce and/or protected by their unions and there is a much
greater
> investment by the owner in their knowledge of the businees they are
in. If
> the beleif system is that any substitution can be made, it has little
> perceived value. The lower down the totem the more readily replaced by
more
> compliant/ less questioning/cheaper/less qualified/better looking or
better
> golf score/less skilled persons.
>
> "need to stay where they are........" They dont and wont, because you
have
> to move up to survive or be perpetually vulnerable. They become
disposable
> commoditized "human resources" (like the desks and erasers) with no
control
> over their livelihood or direction (told what to do) ... beaten down
to the
> lowest price or function . The bad managers issue (need less) is quite
> valid. Many are just expediters... ie work faster/harder. They rarely
have
> the knowledge or good judgement.
> How do you assess or value skilled or quality practitioners when
price is
> the over-riding criteria and QBS is an under-rated or ill executed
nebulous
> criteria. Only when price.. ie. the bottom dollar is equal, is skill
the
> determinant.
>
> Ever noticed how when layoffs come the line workers, grunts,
technicians of
> their professions are laid off in droves, often with little rationale
other
> than on the "Wrong project" by accident or just axing with abandon.
The
> managers , "project managers/PEs" - those ""in or closer to the
drivers
> seat"" survive longer or invoke the Peter principle. Who lost their
money /
> pensions in BRE-ex , Nortel, Enron.., Argentina... Worldcom ........
>
> Fight your way up or Sink, its a dog eat dog world....... you
> trolled.......bite for grabs.
Yahoo! Groups Links
Yahoo! Groups Links Received on Sun Apr 25 14:30:00 2004
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