Dear Roy,
Hope that everything is fine with you. Are you coming to Muscat in the near future? Please advise. I need a copy of the newly published book related to project management.
Your prompt reply will be highly appreciated.
> You may try again www.gramya.com
>
>
> NK Roy
>
>
> --- Michael Waugh <mike@waudesign.com> wrote:
> > I dont believe your link workd below. May want to
> > check.
> >
> > Mike Waugh
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Narendra Roy [mailto:narendra_roy@yahoo.com]
> > Sent: Sunday, April 25, 2004 2:26 PM
> > To: <a href="/group/PipingDesign/post?postID=D0pITPNk6_wV-WVOjDlfPm_pxWt3eow5mllLBZsLMlndGMmDCW-ijKVnTT6MBWJ-FRUFEjuI54pOdknAy9M1GJykjAGNMw">PipingDesign@yahoogroups.com</a>
> > Subject: RE: [PipingDesign] New Current Interesting
> > Link - Drawing on Ex
> >
> >
> > It is turning out to be discussion on wider aspects,
> > the total project
> > management which covers the Piping Design as a part,
> > may be an important
> > part.If I have not forgotten the subject, it seems I
> > have authored a book on
> > Project Management ( Indian Scenario) some 4 years
> > back and was recieved
> > well by the professionals in India and even
> > abroad.Now I understand the
> > importance of the role of the project manager better
> > when a piping design
> > group discusses in such details worldwide
> > appreciating the managers role.
> > Any body having interest in the book may refer the
> > website
> > www.gramya.comThanksNK Roy--- Al wrote:> some
> > really excellent points from
> > mike;> > H'es right on the money. The role of
> > managing a> project doing the>
> > calculations and doing the detail designwork are
> > all> value added essential>
> > roles. Many clients try to role them all into one.>
> > On a very small project>
> > its possible with a rare and very skilled>
> > practictioner.> The time it takes
> > to communicate, get the real> picture,
> > collect the> information, and keep going down the
> > right track is> an
> > invaluable role and> cannot be trivialized. Ever
> > noticed how on the other>
> > side the buyer/owner> calls up , communicates , asks
> > questions, gives>
> > feedback and direction or> wants input or project
> > updates and is all doing
> > this> on his companies (paid)> time.> When you try
> > to add manhours for these
> > tasks, or put> it on your bill, they> only want to
> > pay for the time "on the>
> > board/computer"/ producing the calc or> the piece of
> > paper. Somehow the
> > other> equally (if not more) important stuff has no>
> > recompensory value,
> > only in> their time. IT is just ignorance
> > (sometimes> deliberate on thier
> > part). They> sure bitch if things go astray or off
> > track.> > This is where a
> > good manager/PE shines and there are> some (not many
> > ) out> there. Attempts
> > by owners to subvert bypass role> into one
> > overloaded> individual and
> > shortcut all that, or mishandling it> by poor
> > co-ordinating> skills is just
> > asking for trouble. And that
> > happens> lots.> > Why are we discussing this;
> > because as expectations> get
> > higher and they are,> things get more complex and
> > they are, accountability>
> > increases and it is,> buyers of these services get
> > further and further>
> > removed from what it takes> to do it.OFten they dont
> > even have a clue what>
> > information you need and dont> want to pay the time
> > it takes to get it.> Its
> > getting worse as owners get more and more> removed
> > from engineering and>
> > just want a turnkey product , but want to stick>
> > their fingers in the pie>
> > about how its getting done.> > Sticking our
> > collective heads in the sand
> > doesnt> help address and correct> the issues. they
> > need to be openly
> > discussed and> REBUFFED for what they> are....
> > ignorance ,lack of knowledge
> > and lack of> understanding.> > > -----Original
> > Message-----> From: Michael
> > Waugh [mailto:mike@waudesign.com]> Sent: Sunday,
> > April 25, 2004 10:20 AM>
> > To: PipingDesign@yahoogroups.com> Subject: RE:
> > [PipingDesign] New Current
> > Interesting> Link - Drawing on
> > Ex> > > Chris:> > I agree with your comments and
> > thanks for your>
> > response.> > Regarding some of the original subject
> > matter, is> the first
> > mistake made> when we even discriminate between the
> > two? CAD has> been
> > around for say,> 10-15 years. Mechanical
> > engineeering (for> one)...many more
> > years. The> inclusion of CAD into these various
> > displines and> technical
> > sciences forces> changes and challenges to our
> > original concepts of> what it
> > today that make a> person educated or for that
> > matter qualified, in any>
> > particular field. It is> after all, the employer
> > that some sets these>
> > demands. The same applies to> materials. There is
> > an overwelming aspect to
> > this> stuff, one that will never> be adressed by
> > downsizing and lumping>
> > responsibilities into one. Personally,> I like to to
> > feel that I can tackle
> > sciences> "en-masse", realizing as well I> never be
> > an expert at in one
> > particular area. > Probably the best lesson I> got
> > at university, was
> > learning just how much I did> not know.
> > Managing the> level of understanding is the key.> >
> > I was interviewing with
> > a company the other that> does work for Tropicana.>
> > They initially wanted a
> > Project Manager, someone> with AutoCAD experience
> > as> well as of course,
> > plant experience. Well, I fit the> mold. What
> > became> apparent, this company
> > was under some pressure> because whoever it was
> > they> were trying to
> > appease, was asking why they needed> to have project
> > Manager> and a CAD guy.
> > The giveaway, "well, maybe we need to> consider
> > someone who> can do both"
> > Typical. Tropicana wants to save a> buck, and is
> > tiring> gettting billed for
> > both, by an engineering company> that has more
> > medals> than generals do.> >
> > Not to mention the greater
> > problem....communications> between those two
> > sods> who would wind up chasing each other in
> > circles,> until finally, they
> > would> accomplish the design goals required. Add to
> > this,> all the
> > complexities of> meeting the deployment according
> > standards (Colors,>
> > layering etc.), that add> more pain
> > to the equation than meets the eye. just> add
> > variables that are> not
> > necessarily or absolutely important but are>
> > features inherent to the>
> > software and nonetheless add to diversions. What
> > one> encounters with>
> > programs like AutoCAD (most common) vs software
> > such> as 3d modelling>
> > software that can really do the job, then something>
> > has to give.> > So, I
> > told this guy. Look, I am familiar with this>
> > problem, these are issues> I
> > have had to face. But, dont hamstring me. When you>
> > try to lump all these>
> > into one, the solution is not found, I have been>
> > there. I will happily>
> > tackle design, plant engineering, contractors,>
> > product issues and
> > regulatory> BS, you name it. But, I can only do so
> > efficiently> using the
> > tools that I> have found to really work, so as to
> > not have to> address the
> > ire of someone> such as a production manager (Trop),
> > who likely has> no
> > concept of the depth> involved.> > I am about ready
> > for one of the Roo's in
> > the oil> can, that is. Stay away> from those brown
> > bottles, they've been laced with> monobutyl tin
> > trichloride,> first
> > vaporised then destructed after molding.> > Regards>
> > > Mike Waugh> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----> From: Christopher
> > Wright>
> > [mailto:chrisw@skypoint.com]> Sent: Saturday, April
> > 24, 2004 4:35 PM> To:
> > Pipingdesign> Subject: Re: [PipingDesign] New
> > Current Interesting> Link -
> > Drawing on Ex> > > >But, there is after all, a whole
> > world in materials>
> > science that goes> >beyond statics, dynamics,
> > kinematics and the> physical
> > world, etc. I have> >been witness to engineers
> > select the cheapest> material
> > and the wrong> >materials. And yep, they call
> > themselves engineers.> It
> > works both ways. I've run into metallurgists and>
> > materials scientists> who
> > know everything about materials except what> makes
> > them fail. It's> fairly
> > common in the forensic biz.> > >I have seen many
> > instances where an employer
> > for> example,> >wants a CAD designer with an
> > engineering degree.>
> >
> === message truncated ===
>
>
>
>
>
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Received on Mon Apr 26 02:44:00 2004
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